Listen Here

| |

Actionable
Takeaways

Prioritize Customer Success as Your Primary Growth Engine:

Everflow generates 60% of customer revenue through referrals by investing heavily in customer success—their largest team. When you're a more advanced platform requiring onboarding complexity, exceptional support transforms customers into true fans who actively recommend you to industry peers. This creates a compounding growth loop where happy customers become your most effective sales channel.

Rethink Affiliate Marketing as a Strategic Brand Channel:

Traditional affiliate marketing focused narrowly on last-click revenue attribution, missing the substantial top-of-funnel value that publications like Forbes and Wirecutter provide. Track the full customer journey—engagement metrics, pricing page visits, and post-purchase behavior—to demonstrate how affiliate relationships drive higher-value customers who return and upgrade more frequently than those acquired through direct response channels.

Optimize for AI Citation and Discovery:

With ChatGPT and Gemini pulling answers from multiple publications simultaneously, getting mentioned in long-tail publisher content is now critical for brand discovery. Build strategic affiliate relationships with publishers not just for performance tracking, but to ensure your brand appears in their content with the right messaging and sentiment that LLMs will cite when answering category-related queries.

Turn Expert Knowledge into Discoverable Content:

Most industry expertise lives in people's heads and has never been documented. Use AI to transform expert conversations into citation-worthy content: conduct calls with customers, partners, and industry experts, feed the transcripts into Gemini, and create "masterclass" articles that capture proprietary insights. This content becomes discoverable by LLMs even without ranking highly in traditional SEO.

Use Notebook LM for Systematic Customer Intelligence:

Upload transcripts from sales calls that converted to customers, then query the collection to extract patterns about what prospects care about, which verticals they're in, and where they struggle. Use these insights to refine website messaging, sales enablement, and product positioning based on authentic customer feedback that would otherwise go unanalyzed.

Scale Down Profitable Channels That Create the Wrong Growth Dynamics:

Even when Google Ads generates positive ROI, evaluate whether the channel avalanches your sales team with low-intent leads and produces customers who struggle with onboarding. Bootstrapped efficiency means optimizing for sustainable, word-of-mouth-driven growth rather than maximizing short-term revenue from channels that don't compound.

Choose AI Tools Based on Work Style, Not Hype:

Gemini excels at providing critical, actionable feedback ("headline terrible, first section terrible") rather than being a "yes person" like ChatGPT or Claude. This makes it superior for website critiques and strategic assessments. It's also stronger for email writing due to Gmail data integration. Test paid versions of AI tools rather than free tiers, as the quality difference is substantial.

Build Community Through Exclusive Conference Experiences:

Host memorable parties at industry conferences exclusively for customers to build tribal identity and loyalty. When customers know they have access to the coolest events at every conference, it creates ongoing goodwill and reinforces their decision to remain customers and advocates.

Structure Agency Partnerships as a Two-Way Referral System:

In channels requiring specialized expertise like affiliate marketing, sending prospects to trusted agencies creates a reciprocal relationship where agencies recommend your platform to their clients. This generates highly qualified leads since prospects arrive with committed implementation partners already in place.

Focus AI Implementation on High-Leverage Use Cases:

Most AI applications remain hype and distraction. The two proven use cases for marketers are summarization (transcripts to content, calls to emails, research synthesis) and discoverability (creating content that gets cited by LLMs). Concentrate resources on these areas rather than chasing every new AI capability.

Conversation
Highlights

 

In this episode of The Marketing Front Lines, we speak with Michael Cole, Senior Vice President of Marketing at Everflow. Everflow is a bootstrapped partner marketing platform that has scaled to $28 million in ARR through a referral-driven growth engine and exceptional customer success. Michael shares how affiliate marketing is evolving from a performance-only channel into a strategic driver of brand discovery, particularly as AI-powered search transforms how buyers find and evaluate solutions. From leveraging AI tools like Gemini and Notebook LM to building a masterclass content series that capitalizes on LLM citations, Michael reveals the tactical playbook that’s working in 2025.

 

Topics Discussed

  • The evolution of affiliate marketing from coupon-focused performance channels to strategic brand-building partnerships that drive top-of-funnel awareness and long-term customer value
  • How AI-powered search (ChatGPT, Gemini) is creating new opportunities for publishers and reshaping the discovery landscape through citation-based recommendations
  • Building a 60% referral-driven growth engine through customer success excellence, agency partnerships, and community building at industry conferences
  • Using AI tools strategically: Gemini for content creation and critical feedback, Notebook LM for analyzing sales call transcripts to extract customer insights
  • Creating “masterclass” content by converting expert interviews into discoverable, citation-worthy articles that capture proprietary knowledge
  • The strategic decision to scale down profitable Google Ads despite positive ROI to focus resources on channels that drive sustainable word-of-mouth growth

 

Recommended Founder
Interviews

Andy Mowat

CEO and Co-Founder of Gated

Andy Mowat, CEO and Co-Founder of Gated: Over $3 Million Raised to Build Noise Cancelling Headphones for Email

Dan Malgran

VP of Marketing of Steno

Dan Malgran, VP of Marketing at Steno: Elevating Legal Tech with Revenue-Driven Marketing Strategies

Tom Lee

Co-Founder of LOVO AI

Tom Lee, Co-Founder of LOVO AI: $7 Million Raised to Build the Future of AI Voiceovers

Ishveen Jolly

CEO and Co-Founder of OpenSponsorship

Ishveen Jolly, CEO and Co-Founder of OpenSponsorship: Over $5 Million Raised to Build the Future of Sports Influencer Marketing

Philipp de la Haye

Senior Vice President of Marketin of FrontNow

AI Will Cut Marketing Teams to 2 People – Here’s the Playbook

Rush Shahani

Co-Founder & CTO of Persana AI

Rush Shahani, Co-Founder & CTO of Persana AI: $2.3 Million Raised to Power the Future of GTM

Katy Carrigan

CEO of Goody

Katy Carrigan, CEO of Goody: $32 Million Raised to Build the Future of Corporate Gifting

Daniel Saks

CEO & Co-Founder of Landbase

Daniel Saks, CEO & Co-Founder of Landbase: $12.5 Million Raised to Power the Future of GTM Automation

Leena Joshi

CEO of CloseFactor

Leena Joshi, CEO of CloseFactor: $15+ Million Raised to Automate Repetitive Sales Processes

Matt Krebsbach

Senior Vice President of Thought Leadership & Brand Awareness of Acquia

From Politics to PR: Building Unassailable Market Position

Omed Habib

VP of Sapient AI

Omed Habib, VP of Marketing at Sapient AI: A Technical Founder’s Guide to B2B SaaS Marketing

Hikari Senju

CEO and Founder of Omneky

Hikari Senju, CEO and Founder of Omneky: $10 Million Raised to Empower Brands With AI-Powered Ads To Maximize Performance

Tine Karlsen

Co-Founder & CEO of Vev

Tine Karlsen, CEO and Co-Founder of Vev: $7 Million Raised to Power the Future of No-Code Visual Design

Max Elster

CEO & Founder of Minoa

Max Elster, CEO & Founder of Minoa: $2.7 Million Raised to Build the Go-to-Market Value Intelligence Platform

Justas Malinauskas

CEO & Co-Founder of Whatagraph

How Whatagraph generates 500+ marketing qualified leads monthly through competitor pain point SEO | Justas Malinauskas ($10+ Million Raised)

Marty Ringlein

CEO & Co-Founder of Agree.com

Marty Ringlein, CEO & Co-Founder of Agree.com: $3M Raised to Transform Contract-Based Revenue Management

Lars Grønnegaard Hansen

CEO and Co-Founder of Dreamdata

Lars Grønnegaard Hansen, CEO & Co-Founder of Dreamdata: $12 Million Raised to Build the Future of B2B Revenue Attribution

Nupur Bhade Vilas

Head of Product Marketing of Kustomer

Product Marketing Masterclass w/ Nupur Bhade Vilas, Head of Product Marketing at Kustomer

Alex Reynolds

Alex Reynolds, CEO & Co-Founder of Vendelux: $20 Million Raised to Build the Future of Event Intelligence

Stephen Karaolis

Marketing Director of Cleary

Stephen Karaolis, Marketing Director at Cleary: Mastering Speed to Market – The Key to Dynamic Content Strategy

Andrew Forman

Founder of Givz

Andrew Forman, CEO of Givz: $3 Million Raised to Make Donating, Not Discounts, eCommerce Brands Ultimate Growth Lever

Sam Fonoimoana

Founder & CEO of Datajoin

Sam Fonoimoana, Founder & CEO of Datajoin: $3.5 Million Raised to Help Brands Leverage Customer Behavioral Insights

Parry Bedi

Co-Founder and CEO of Tingono

Parry Bedi, CEO of Tingono: $7 Million Raised to Help Companies Boost Net Revenue Retention

Chris Strahl

CEO of Knapsack

Chris Strahl, CEO of Knapsack: $7 Million Raised to Build the Future of Design Systems

Ashish Nagar

Founder & CEO of Level AI

Ashish Nagar, CEO of Level AI: $35 Million Raised to Power Contact Centers of the Future

Pulkit Agrawal

CEO & Co-Founder of Chameleon

Pulkit Agrawal, CEO & Co-Founder of Chameleon: $15 Million Raised to Build the Product Adoption Category

Michael Bamberger

CEO and Founder of Tetra Insights

Michael Bamberger, CEO and Founder of Tetra Insights: $7 Million Raised to Power the Future of Qualitative Research

Zack Rosenberg

CEO and Founder of Qortex

Zack Rosenberg, CEO & Founder of Qortex: $11 Million Raised to Build the Future of Video Analytics

Jonathan Legge

Co-Founder and CEO of &Open

Jonathan Legge, Co-Founder and CEO at &Open: Over $35 Million Raised to Create the Future of Corporate Gifting

CEO and Co-Founder of Sendoso

Creating the Sending Management Category with Sendoso’s Kris Rudeegraap

Patrick Woods

CEO and Co-Founder of Orbit

Patrick Woods, CEO and Co-Founder of Orbit: Over $22 Million Raised to Power the Future of Communities

Canay Deniz

CEO & Co-Founder of Ren Systems

Canay Deniz, CEO & Co-Founder of Ren Systems: $8.8 Million Raised to Build the Future of Relationship Intelligence for Dealmakers

Elio Narciso

Co-Founder & CEO of Scalestack

How Scalestack landed MongoDB as their first enterprise customer through cold email | Elio Narciso ($3.1 Million Raised)

Sangram Vajre

Co Founder and CEO of GTM Partners

Behind the Category: Creating the Account-Based Marketing (ABM) Category with Sangram Vajre

Jonas Rinde

CEO of Nomono

Jonas Rinde, CEO of Nomono: $15 million Raised to Power the Future of Podcasting

Rajat Mishra

Founder & CEO of Prezent

Rajat Mishra, Founder & CEO at Prezent: Over $24 Million Raised to Build the Presentation Productivity Platform Category

Tyler Strand

Co-Founder and CTO of Air

Tyler Strand, Co-Founder and CTO at Air: $38 Million raised to Build the Creative Operations Category

Jared Siegal

CEO and Founder of Aditude

Jared Siegal, CEO and Founder of Aditude: $15 Million Raised to Build the Future of Publisher Monetization

Robert Thelen

CEO & Founder of Rownd

Robert Thelen, CEO & Founder of Rownd: $3.3 Million Raised to Build the Future of App Onboarding

Ori Entis

CEO and Co-Founder of Staircase AI

Ori Entis, CEO and Co-Founder of Staircase AI: $5 Million Raised to Power the Future of Customer Revenue Growth

Taylor Lint

CEO and Founder of Swantide

Taylor Lint, CEO and Founder of Swantide: $7 Million Raised to Revolutionize How Companies Design and Build Their GTM Infrastructure

Dan Rua

CEO of Admiral

Dan Rua, CEO of Admiral: $28 Million Raised to Build the Future of Visitor Relationship Management

Ted Skinner

Vice President of Marketing of Fullintel

The RISE Framework: Getting Found When AI Does the Searching

Creating the Marketing Automation Category with Mark Organ

CEO of Eloqua

Creating the Marketing Automation Category with Mark Organ

Cory Schmidt

Head of Marketing of Heyflow

Mastering Organic Growth: Insights from Heyflow’s Head of Marketing

Pierce Ujjainwalla

CEO of Knak

Pierce Ujjainwalla, CEO of Knak: $25 Million Raised to Empower Enterprise Marketers with Codeless Email and Landing Page Creation

Vinay Jain

Founder of MadMen AI

Vinay Jain, Founder of MadMen AI: $4.5 Million Raised to Build the Future of AI-Powered Marketing Platforms

Adrien Menard

CEO and Co-Founder of Botify

Adrien Menard, CEO and Co-Founder of Botify: $82 Million Raised to Build the Future of SEO

Marty Kausas

CEO & Co-Founder of Pylon

Marty Kausas, CEO & Co-Founder of Pylon: $20 Million Raised to Build the First B2B Support Platform

John Jahnke

CEO and Co-Founder of Tackle.io

John Jahnke, CEO and Co-Founder of Tackle.io: $148 Million Raised to Build the Future of Cloud Go-to-Market

Chris Golec

CEO and Founder of Channel99

Chris Golec, CEO and Founder of Channel99: $5 Million Raised to Power the Future of B2B Marketing

Daniel Erickson

Founder and CEO of Viable

Daniel Erickson, CEO of Viable: $9 Million Raised to Build the Future of Customer Feedback Analysis

Marc Bernstein

CEO and Founder of Balto

Marc Bernstein, CEO and Founder of Balto: $52 Million Raised to Power the Future of Contact Centers

Thomas Millay

CEO of DemandJump

Thomas Millay, CEO at DemandJump: Over $25 Million Raised to Power the Future of Content Strategy

Sam Mallikarjunan

Co-Founder & CEO of OneScreen

Sam Mallikarjunan, Co-Founder & CEO of OneScreen: $10 Million Raised to Power the Future of Offline Advertising

Creating the Go to Market Category with ZoomInfo’s Bryan Law

CMO of ZoomInfo

Creating the Go to Market Category with ZoomInfo’s Bryan Law